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Tim C
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Post  Tim C Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:05 am

Hi everyone. Have not been on here in ages. I struggled thru Boston with my knee in 2017 and scaled way back on running after that, typically running 2-3 miles a couple of times a week. Knee got worse and worse so I shut down running several months ago, although I walk quite a bit. Sucks when I run into old running buddies on the trail and can’t go with them.
Fast forward a bit and I decided a couple of months ago to move forward with a partial knee replacement. I’m bone on bone on the inside but the outside and knee cap are fine. I had the procedure yesterday and am very hopeful for the long term improvement. I am walking and first night sleep was pretty comfortable so all is good right now.
Keep up the good work all.
Tim
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Post  ounce Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:53 am

Gratz on your successful replacement and welcome back! 

So was it years of running that necessitated the replacement or an injury that spurred it or both or what?

You'll be a source of information for us, so please don't be a stranger.  There are 3 of us here that have had different versions of heart attacks and returned to running and other forms of getting outside.  So, we can repay!
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Post  Tim C Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:20 am

Thanks Ounce. No, I tore my knee up a bit playing football I HS. Started running at 50 which I’m sure aggravated it somewhat but I had 3 arthroscopic surgeries before that. I have known for years that I needed a replacement but I never felt it was THAT bad but it finally got to a quality of life issue. My wife like to hike and my knee has relegated me to walking on flat ground.
Everything I have heard and read says you cannot (should not) run on a replaced knee. My surgeon confirmed that but says that he would be ok with my running after the uni-compartment procedure I had done. Short runs only, 3-5 miles tops, but that would be awesome if I could. I did not have this done in order to start running again, but that would be a great perk if it worked out.
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Post  nkrichards Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:48 pm

Great to hear from you Tim.  Glad you had the opportunity to complete Boston before your knee forced you into early retirement.  Hope that you'll be able to return to the hiking trails with your wife and maybe even the occasional short/easy run in the future.  

Things are pretty quiet around here.  Ounce and I post pretty regularly.  Mark, Michele, Kevin and a couple others also drop in.  Don't be a stranger.  We'd love to hear how your recovery and return to activity goes.

Do I remember correctly...did you use Hanson training for your BQ marathon?  I know you had been having knee trouble for a while and that's a lot of mileage so I'm not sure I remember correctly.  I recently switched from a "Run Less, Run Faster" 3 day a week type training to the cumulative fatigue Hanson type training.  I'm liking what I'm seeing.  Obviously I haven't raced yet but I can see improvement even though I haven't worked through a full training cycle yet.  If you did use Hanson type training do you have any thoughts that might be helpful?

Hope recovery continues to go well...
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Post  Tim C Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:16 pm

Hey Nancy,
Nice to hear from you. Yeah, I’ve jumped on the site couple of times but not a lot of activity and I’ve had nothing to add obviously.
Yes, I used the Hanson Method at the suggestion of Michael Young. Read it cover to cover in one day and knew immediately that it was for me. MUCH higher overall mileage yet far LESS emphasis on the long run. I used to get beat up on the Saturday long run and had to run the next few days recovering.
With Hanson, I took my goal time and plugged in all of the paces recommended for the 6 runs a week. Followed them to a tee and the result spoke for itself. I will never run another marathon but if I did, I would follow the same plan again.
I really liked the mid-week 10-12 mile marathon pace runs. Pretty soon having to hold back on these runs to not go to fast became a real confidence builder for me.
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Post  nkrichards Thu Jul 30, 2020 1:10 pm

Tim C wrote:Hey Nancy,
Nice to hear from you. Yeah, I’ve jumped on the site couple of times but not a lot of activity and I’ve had nothing to add obviously.
Yes, I used the Hanson Method at the suggestion of Michael Young. Read it cover to cover in one day and knew immediately that it was for me. MUCH higher overall mileage yet far LESS emphasis on the long run. I used to get beat up on the Saturday long run and had to run the next few days recovering.
With Hanson, I took my goal time and plugged in all of the paces recommended for the 6 runs a week. Followed them to a tee and the result spoke for itself. I will never run another marathon but if I did, I would follow the same plan again.
I really liked the mid-week 10-12 mile marathon pace runs. Pretty soon having to hold back on these runs to not go to fast became a real confidence builder for me.
That's encouraging info Tim.  I know Michele also advocates for Hanson type training.

I had never completely recovered my running abilities after my cardiac event and had really let my running slide over the winter and early spring.  I started back up using Hanson's beginner half marathon training plan as a guideline late spring/early summer.  The speed & strength work in the half plan is identical to the speed and strength work in the full plan so I allowed myself some extra time to build to those levels.  As I said I haven't raced yet but I'm really liking what I've seen so far.  I was concerned about running 6 days a week but I've adjusted well so far.

Did you do any cross training in addition to running?  Any core or strength work?
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Post  Tim C Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:26 am

The speed and strength work were completely new too me, but totally prepared me for the actually training.  I never had a plan before as the group I ran with used Hal's build-up on the long runs but the rest of my runs were just random.  This plan has a reason for every run and I loved the structured approach.  I never missed a run but I did cheat a couple of times...  The long runs max out at 16 but as I was finishing my first 16 mile long run, I realized I was at 59 for the week... I felt good so I tacked 2 more on and made it 61.  Never had a weeks mileage in the 60's before.

I did very little core work and I know I should have done more.  Don't know why but I think nothing of heading out for a 90 minute run but then don't have time for 15 minutes of stretching and core....
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Post  KBFitz Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:48 am

Thanks for checking in Tim. Best of luck with your recovery. I'm very pleased you were able to compete at Boston before your knees shut down the very long distances. Keep us posted as you proceed -- whether you're running or not. Doing strength or core work or just getting out for a walk or hike can serve to keep the recovery going. (I haven't run for a few weeks now but I keep posting anyway!) Be well, be healthy and best of luck with your recovery.
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Post  Mark B Wed Aug 05, 2020 2:00 pm

Hi Tim! Thanks for checking in. I hope the surgery delivers and you can get back out there as soon as possible.

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Post  Tim C Tue Aug 25, 2020 10:34 pm

Things are going well.  4 weeks out today from surgery.  Been going to PT 3x a week which sometimes sucks but BIG improvements so far.  Funny how little things make you smile.  We live in a 2 story house... I can now, for the first time in years, walk up the stairs one at a time without holding onto the handrail and step up with that left leg with zero pain!  The quad is weak as I have favored it for ages but it is getting stronger every day.  Just doing step ups at PT with no pain is amazing.

Still a bit swollen but I can now get to 115 degrees flexion (130-135 will be Nirvana) and all the way straight.  Did a 1.5 mile walk Sunday with no issues.  Very glad I had this done and expect even more improvement over the next few weeks.

Still miss running but who knows what is in store down the road.

Funny but there is a young man who runs for USC that is at the PT gym almost every time I go.  Recovering from an injury and since his classes are all online, he stays at home and goes to this gym (we are about 45 minutes to an 1 hour from the campus).  He was on the treadmill the other day and I asked one of the people there what what pace he was at.  She walked over and he was at a smooth 4:50.  I say smooth because it looked effortless....  Oh to be young and fast...
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Post  nkrichards Wed Aug 26, 2020 5:03 pm

Tim C wrote:Things are going well.  4 weeks out today from surgery.  Been going to PT 3x a week which sometimes sucks but BIG improvements so far.  Funny how little things make you smile.  We live in a 2 story house... I can now, for the first time in years, walk up the stairs one at a time without holding onto the handrail and step up with that left leg with zero pain!  The quad is weak as I have favored it for ages but it is getting stronger every day.  Just doing step ups at PT with no pain is amazing.

Still a bit swollen but I can now get to 115 degrees flexion (130-135 will be Nirvana) and all the way straight.  Did a 1.5 mile walk Sunday with no issues.  Very glad I had this done and expect even more improvement over the next few weeks.

Still miss running but who knows what is in store down the road.

Funny but there is a young man who runs for USC that is at the PT gym almost every time I go.  Recovering from an injury and since his classes are all online, he stays at home and goes to this gym (we are about 45 minutes to an 1 hour from the campus).  He was on the treadmill the other day and I asked one of the people there what what pace he was at.  She walked over and he was at a smooth 4:50.  I say smooth because it looked effortless....  Oh to be young and fast...
 Good to hear that your recovery is going well.  My husband has had knee pain for years and isn't willing to consider a replacement yet.  I was pleased to share your story with him...it got him thinking about his options and the potential to improve his quality of life.  He's not a runner.  He just wants to be able to continue to work and hunt.

Loved your story about the young runner at the gym.  It brought back memories of my days in cardiac rehab.  I progressed quickly back to running on the treadmill while most of the participants struggled to even walk slowly.  It was a humbling experience that made me thankful that my slow down was just a bump in the road and not a permanent condition.  We shared a lot of personal stories...and a lot of laughs...during our time together.  My Dad used to always say that no matter what your circumstances are you can find someone who is worse off and someone who is better off.

Hope the recovery continues to progress quickly.
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Post  Tim C Thu Aug 27, 2020 8:57 pm

Thanks Nancy.  I was told 15 or 20 years ago that I would need that knee replaced but I always felt it wasn't 'THAT' bad.  But then it got to where it became a quality of life issue and after 4 weeks, I am confident I will be VERY happy that I did this.

The problem is we figure out how to do things without it hurting so much.  I am honestly having to re-learn how to walk correctly because I have favored that leg for so long.

Give me shout if your husband would like to chat about it.
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Post  nkrichards Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:21 pm

Tim C wrote:Thanks Nancy.  I was told 15 or 20 years ago that I would need that knee replaced but I always felt it wasn't 'THAT' bad.  But then it got to where it became a quality of life issue and after 4 weeks, I am confident I will be VERY happy that I did this.

The problem is we figure out how to do things without it hurting so much.  I am honestly having to re-learn how to walk correctly because I have favored that leg for so long.

Give me shout if your husband would like to chat about it.
Thanks Tim.  The doctor agrees that he's not ready yet but I expect that he'll get to that point at some time.  Thanks for offering to chat with him.  I'll let you know if it's needed.

Stay well.
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Post  Michele "1L" Keane Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:02 pm

Hi Tim - hope that rehab is still progressing.  Nice to hear from you.
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Post  Tim C Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:51 pm

So I had my 12 week post-op visit with my surgeon last week and he turned me loose to run. Did a couple of easy, slow run / walks and then today went out and run an easy mile with 1 walk break. Felt great although REALLY slow. Lol.
As I said earlier, I did not do this so that I could run again but he is very comfortable with my running for several reasons. 1. I had a partial replacement instead of a full one. 2. I am not overweight. 3. I have a history of running and 4. I swore that I would keep it to short runs only.
So I am hoping to build up to 3-5 miles a couple of times a week. Did not realize how nice it was going to feel to run, albeit very slowly, after all this time off.
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Post  nkrichards Fri Nov 13, 2020 3:15 pm

That's fantastic news Tim!  An easy run is better than no run at all!

I was bored while driving tractor the other day and listened to an interesting podcast on Six Minute Mile.  They interviewed Roger Robinson.  He's an athlete and an author and happens to be married to Katherine Switzer.  He was preparing to return to masters racing...at the age of 82...after his second knee replacement...when COVID shut down racing.  He's become a closely followed experiment and so far the benefits of keeping the muscles surrounding the knee strong or proving to be more beneficial than any wear and tear on the knee.

Good luck...enjoy being back out on the road. Running Running
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Post  Tim C Fri Nov 13, 2020 5:58 pm

My surgeon said that I am a fairly unique case for a couple of reasons. 1. He says he does 10x more full replacements than partials. 2. He said my interior was seriously messed up but the exterior was perfect as is my entire right knee.
He encouraged me to go ahead and use / abuse the knee and to come back every 6 months for follow up x-rays / evaluation. Apparently I am a ‘test’ case.
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Post  ounce Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:50 pm

Excellent, Tim!  Seems like your doc has a guinea pig to write an article about, maybe.

Good luck on your running and don't be a stranger.
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Post  KBFitz Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:28 am

Great to hear you've been cleared to get back underway (modestly) on the roads. Keep us posted as you are an experiment in keepin' on keepin' on.
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Post  Mark B Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:14 am

Great news that you're able to get out there and run again. I'm sure you're going to give your doctor all sorts of data to review.

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Post  Michele "1L" Keane Tue Nov 17, 2020 2:31 pm

Great news, Tim!   My daughter's dog torn his CCL (Dog ACL) so I've been taking him to rehab - not quite the same, but he is happy to run again too.  Keep on running!
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Post  Tim C Sun Nov 22, 2020 12:28 pm

Ran 2 miles yesterday with a couple of walk breaks thrown in.  ZERO pain.  Hit some golf balls after and then installed a bunch of low-voltage lights in the yard.  Pretty stiff / sore in the lower back after.  Note to self: work on your core, work on your core, work on your core...

Did another easy run / walk this morning and feel great.  I am SO happy I had this surgery done...
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Post  Tim C Sun Dec 13, 2020 9:25 pm

Up to running 2 miles now.  Knee feels AWESOME, my cardio not so much.  Simply amazing how difficult it is to get IN to good shape and how easy it is to get OUT of good shape.

Absolutely ZERO pain running today.
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Post  nkrichards Sun Dec 13, 2020 9:52 pm

Tim C wrote:Up to running 2 miles now.  Knee feels AWESOME, my cardio not so much.  Simply amazing how difficult it is to get IN to good shape and how easy it is to get OUT of good shape.

Absolutely ZERO pain running today.

That's fantastic news Tim.  The cardio will come now that the knee is cooperating.  Give it time and enjoy every stride!!
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Post  Tim C Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:55 pm

Curious what you guys are using to log your runs.  I was using the David Hayes Dead Runners spreadsheet but it is in 97 Excel format and I have to believe there is something much more current that I could be using.
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