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Max HR based off of 5k?

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John Kilpatrick
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Post  Kenny B. Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:01 am

I think I read on the old boards maybe by MartinVW that one should add a few points to their max HR at the end of a 5k race. Example my MAX HR during 5k is 196 almost religiously. Does this mean possibly I am more like 200-201? I do use 200-205 as my MAX HR is this about right?


I mean are we every really hitting our max in race or teetering close to max?

Any thoughts?

I just found this from a site:

"5K race can be
used as a test. Average heart rate during the race, or a spot check of heart rate at about
the 2-mile mark should come pretty close to 90% of maximum. Dividing by .9 will give a
pretty reliable estimate of maximum heart rate."


My avg Hr during a 5k is 185 so that would mean my max is about 205.
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Post  Michael Enright Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:36 pm

My recollection of the advice I'd read (and maybe it was Martin passing it along) before was to run the 5k hard until about a mile left, and then just go like crazy until the end. You would check your HR right at the finish, and add a few points, and that ought to be it.
I'm going to try it that way and see.
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Post  Dave-O Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:55 pm

The reason for adding a few points to the Max reading is that's impossible to ever hit your true max. From what I've read, even in a lab setting where one runs to the point of literally collapsing, you'd still be 1 or 2 beats shy of true max.

Personally I've found that I can get a higher reading by doing max effort 800m hill repeats at a 5% incline.
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Post  Kenny B. Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:03 pm

Dave-O wrote:The reason for adding a few points to the Max reading is that's impossible to ever hit your true max. From what I've read, even in a lab setting where one runs to the point of literally collapsing, you'd still be 1 or 2 beats shy of true max.

Personally I've found that I can get a higher reading by doing max effort 800m hill repeats at a 5% incline.

Sounds like a stress test to me. Sure take 800 hill repeat and then add a few points. Seems I am safe at 200pts.
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Post  Nick Morris Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:39 pm

I have only ran 2 or 3 5Ks in my life and have never used them to establish my max. Instead, I used hill repeats to establish a max.
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Post  Kenny B. Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:45 pm

Nick Morris wrote:I have only ran 2 or 3 5Ks in my life and have never used them to establish my max. Instead, I used hill repeats to establish a max.

Looking at some past races I ran a 5 mile last summer maxed out at 199 at the end. It was hot as hell and humid (2 weeks running same race). This is the highest I have hit in any race vs. 196 on avg. I would think I would need at least 800m at 5% or even 6% to get closer to my max. But I ain't testing it out. Ill work with 199+ a few points.
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Post  Nick Morris Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:47 pm

Kenny B. wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:I have only ran 2 or 3 5Ks in my life and have never used them to establish my max. Instead, I used hill repeats to establish a max.

Looking at some past races I ran a 5 mile last summer maxed out at 199 at the end. It was hot as hell and humid (2 weeks running same race). This is the highest I have hit in any race vs. 196 on avg. I would think I would need at least 800m at 5% or even 6% to get closer to my max. But I ain't testing it out. Ill work with 199+ a few points.

I also used the formulas and compared them to my hill repeats and made adjustments from there. My max is roughly 185.
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Post  Kenny B. Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:59 pm

Nick Morris wrote:
Kenny B. wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:I have only ran 2 or 3 5Ks in my life and have never used them to establish my max. Instead, I used hill repeats to establish a max.

Looking at some past races I ran a 5 mile last summer maxed out at 199 at the end. It was hot as hell and humid (2 weeks running same race). This is the highest I have hit in any race vs. 196 on avg. I would think I would need at least 800m at 5% or even 6% to get closer to my max. But I ain't testing it out. Ill work with 199+ a few points.

I also used the formulas and compared them to my hill repeats and made adjustments from there. My max is roughly 185.

Max HR is just what I use so I can figure out my HR reserve. which takes into account resting HR. Another way to make things more confusing or more specific maybe. let's just run! scratch
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Post  Nick Morris Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:14 pm

Kenny B. wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:
Kenny B. wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:I have only ran 2 or 3 5Ks in my life and have never used them to establish my max. Instead, I used hill repeats to establish a max.

Looking at some past races I ran a 5 mile last summer maxed out at 199 at the end. It was hot as hell and humid (2 weeks running same race). This is the highest I have hit in any race vs. 196 on avg. I would think I would need at least 800m at 5% or even 6% to get closer to my max. But I ain't testing it out. Ill work with 199+ a few points.

I also used the formulas and compared them to my hill repeats and made adjustments from there. My max is roughly 185.

Max HR is just what I use so I can figure out my HR reserve. which takes into account resting HR. Another way to make things more confusing or more specific maybe. let's just run! scratch

let's just run!...I like that idea Very Happy
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Post  John Kilpatrick Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:41 pm

Dave-O wrote:The reason for adding a few points to the Max reading is that's impossible to ever hit your true max. From what I've read, even in a lab setting where one runs to the point of literally collapsing, you'd still be 1 or 2 beats shy of true max.

Personally I've found that I can get a higher reading by doing max effort 800m hill repeats at a 5% incline.

Didn't Hal H. also suggest in his book that it is somewhat dangerous to ever find out what a true max is? For what it is worth, I have reached up to about 188 as a max heart rate by the end of a 5K - don't know what my true max is....

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Post  Nick Morris Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:50 pm

John Kilpatrick wrote:
Dave-O wrote:The reason for adding a few points to the Max reading is that's impossible to ever hit your true max. From what I've read, even in a lab setting where one runs to the point of literally collapsing, you'd still be 1 or 2 beats shy of true max.

Personally I've found that I can get a higher reading by doing max effort 800m hill repeats at a 5% incline.

Didn't Hal H. also suggest in his book that it is somewhat dangerous to ever find out what a true max is? For what it is worth, I have reached up to about 188 as a max heart rate by the end of a 5K - don't know what my true max is....

I don't think that you could ever actually reach your max.
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Post  Gobbles Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:37 pm

I don't even come close in a 5K. (I must just be a slacker)

Recent Races (Running as fast as possible):
Max from 1/2 Marathon-1:22:10 (in 55 degs): 172
Max from a 10K-36:20 (in 40 degs): 176 (I ran as hard as I could over the last 1.2 miles)
Max from a 5K-18:00 (80+ Heat Index): 175
Max from a 5K-17:48 (in 40 degs): 173

Last Night: (Ran the 800m, and then about 20 mins later the 1 mile)
Max from an 800m - 2:17 (~90 Deg Heat Index): 181
Max from a 1 mile - 5:14 (~90 Deg Heat Index): 192

I think it is the heat as much as the effort. scratch
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Post  ounce Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:08 pm

Now, don't take this the wrong way but, I think those of y'all younger than 50 years old could have a max of greater than 200.

In 2010, I did a 10K and REALLY poured it on for the last 300m and had a heart rate of 202. At that time, I was around 225 pounds and 52 years old and not in as good a running shape as I am now. So, I would think y'all can punch through the 200 heart rate ceiling.

What I don't know is, since I'm in better shape than in 2010, could I expect a higher max or is my heart conditioned better so 202 couldn't be achieved now? The Shadow knows. Thanks.
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Post  Michele "1L" Keane Wed Jun 29, 2011 9:43 pm

Gobbles wrote:I don't even come close in a 5K. (I must just be a slacker)

Recent Races (Running as fast as possible):
Max from 1/2 Marathon-1:22:10 (in 55 degs): 172
Max from a 10K-36:20 (in 40 degs): 176 (I ran as hard as I could over the last 1.2 miles)
Max from a 5K-18:00 (80+ Heat Index): 175
Max from a 5K-17:48 (in 40 degs): 173

Last Night: (Ran the 800m, and then about 20 mins later the 1 mile)
Max from an 800m - 2:17 (~90 Deg Heat Index): 181
Max from a 1 mile - 5:14 (~90 Deg Heat Index): 192

I think it is the heat as much as the effort. scratch

An old wise coach of mine in GA used to call that "cardiac creep".
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Post  Gobbles Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:18 pm

Cardiac Drift is definitely a major factor during the summer months in GA. You can really see it during Moderate and Long Runs.
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Post  Schuey Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:34 pm

[quote="Nick Morris]Max HR is just what I use so I can figure out my HR reserve. which takes into account resting HR. Another way to make things more confusing or more specific maybe. let's just run! scratch[/quote]

let's just run!...I like that idea Very Happy[/quote]

If and when I do look at HR data while running or after a run I base all my data off of HRR. I fine by doing it that way I get more out of my effort, it that is the best way to put it.

Really though I with Nick "let's just run!" I run and I run off of effort and let that decided how I'm going to train a and race. I find that by training that way I get the most out of my training rather then going off of data that may or may not be correct since I don't know my max hr so why even really pay attention to it anyway.
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