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What Comes Next

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Post  Mark B Wed Jan 29, 2014 1:44 pm

Nick Morris wrote:Just when I thought you couldn't get any crazier!! I remember seeing someone running in sandals when I ran my first marathon up in Minneapolis in 2009.  I don't think that I could do it...

Wait... sandals are crazier than going barefoot?  scratch 
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Post  Nick Morris Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:03 pm

Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:Just when I thought you couldn't get any crazier!! I remember seeing someone running in sandals when I ran my first marathon up in Minneapolis in 2009.  I don't think that I could do it...

Wait... sandals are crazier than going barefoot?  scratch 

IMO, yes. Your feet tend to move/slide around in them. Plus, they are awkward on your feet.
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Post  Mark B Wed Jan 29, 2014 4:57 pm

Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:Just when I thought you couldn't get any crazier!! I remember seeing someone running in sandals when I ran my first marathon up in Minneapolis in 2009.  I don't think that I could do it...

Wait... sandals are crazier than going barefoot?  scratch 

IMO, yes.  Your feet tend to move/slide around in them.  Plus, they are awkward on your feet.

Interesting point. The new lacing system does a better job of keeping my foot in place, but it's true that they work best with more or less "perfect" barefoot form, with no overstriding or push-off. Once you do that (which stimulates a whole different set of muscles), the slip-n-slide awkwardness tends to go away.

I took a video while I was out there. It ought to be good for a couple of giggles. Smile



And if it looks like I was overdressed, it's because I was.
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Post  Nick Morris Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:11 pm

Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:Just when I thought you couldn't get any crazier!! I remember seeing someone running in sandals when I ran my first marathon up in Minneapolis in 2009.  I don't think that I could do it...

Wait... sandals are crazier than going barefoot?  scratch 

IMO, yes.  Your feet tend to move/slide around in them.  Plus, they are awkward on your feet.

Interesting point. The new lacing system does a better job of keeping my foot in place, but it's true that they work best with more or less "perfect" barefoot form, with no overstriding or push-off. Once you do that (which stimulates a whole different set of muscles), the slip-n-slide awkwardness tends to go away.

I took a video while I was out there. It ought to be good for a couple of giggles. Smile



And if it looks like I was overdressed, it's because I was.

Ha...I want to know what your neighbors thought of you as you were running, in sandals, talking and videoing at the same time Smile
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Post  Mark B Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:31 pm

Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:Just when I thought you couldn't get any crazier!! I remember seeing someone running in sandals when I ran my first marathon up in Minneapolis in 2009.  I don't think that I could do it...

Wait... sandals are crazier than going barefoot?  scratch 

IMO, yes.  Your feet tend to move/slide around in them.  Plus, they are awkward on your feet.

Interesting point. The new lacing system does a better job of keeping my foot in place, but it's true that they work best with more or less "perfect" barefoot form, with no overstriding or push-off. Once you do that (which stimulates a whole different set of muscles), the slip-n-slide awkwardness tends to go away.

I took a video while I was out there. It ought to be good for a couple of giggles. Smile



And if it looks like I was overdressed, it's because I was.

Ha...I want to know what your neighbors thought of you as you were running, in sandals, talking and videoing at the same time Smile

They're used to me by now. Nothing I do surprises them anymore. Though one neighbor did stop her minivan and with wonderful smirky melodrama expressed great sympathy that my wife won't let me buy any shoes. Wink
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Post  ounce Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:11 pm

Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
Nick Morris wrote:Just when I thought you couldn't get any crazier!! I remember seeing someone running in sandals when I ran my first marathon up in Minneapolis in 2009.  I don't think that I could do it...

Wait... sandals are crazier than going barefoot?  scratch 

IMO, yes.  Your feet tend to move/slide around in them.  Plus, they are awkward on your feet.

Interesting point. The new lacing system does a better job of keeping my foot in place, but it's true that they work best with more or less "perfect" barefoot form, with no overstriding or push-off. Once you do that (which stimulates a whole different set of muscles), the slip-n-slide awkwardness tends to go away.

I took a video while I was out there. It ought to be good for a couple of giggles. Smile



And if it looks like I was overdressed, it's because I was.

Ha...I want to know what your neighbors thought of you as you were running, in sandals, talking and videoing at the same time Smile

They're used to me by now. Nothing I do surprises them anymore. Though one neighbor did stop her minivan and with wonderful smirky melodrama expressed great sympathy that my wife won't let me buy any shoes. Wink

EVVVVVVVERYONE is used to Mark by now.

By the way,          I thought you        were supposed     to run        conversationally     ,     and not in      choppy        verbal phrases        ?
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Post  Mark B Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:31 pm

ounce wrote:EVVVVVVVERYONE is used to Mark by now.

By the way,          I thought you        were supposed     to run        conversationally     ,     and not in      choppy        verbal phrases        ?

Picked up on that, did you? I noticed it myself. Even though my heart rate was relatively low, running in those sandals had me going huff-puff-huff-puff the whole time. It was really weird!

I'm guessing it was because I was running much more on my forefoot than usual, and changing my mechanics to accommodate it. It got a little easier after a while, but never as easy as going barefoot.
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Post  Mark B Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:47 pm

Quick update on the sandals experiment.

When I woke up this morning, my calves were sure to tell me that they'd been highly stimulated yesterday. That wasn't a big surprise, but I was surprised to discover that the tip of my left big toe -- the one I'd bludgeoned a few months ago -- was sore again. Huh? I must have been coming down a lot less gently in those sandals than I do barefoot, and maybe even pushing off. Hm. That's not exactly optimal.

I checked the video (a higher res version than the one I posted here) and I could see some crazy mechanics going on as I ran. So when I say I'm attempting to improve my mechanics, I think it's safe to say that it's all relative. I think my "perfect" mechanics is probably going to be other people's "just skewered through the leg by a spear." Smile

Hell, the more I look at photos (and X-rays, and ink footprints) of my tootsies, the more I'm kind of amazed that I can run at all.

What Comes Next  - Page 11 Footpr10
(A recent ink footprint of my right foot. Wild, huh?)

Speaking of which, I need to get out there this morning. Back later.


Last edited by Mark B on Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:31 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post  Mark B Thu Jan 30, 2014 3:47 pm

Low HR Run: 4.5 miles

Weather: Overcast, a little breezy, a few raindrops, 45 degrees. Gear: Altras, shorts, long-sleeved T, jacket/vest, hat, gloves for a bit. Fuel: Yogurt/cereal for breakfast. Nothing else before or during run.

This was sort of a recovery run after yesterday's experiment with running in sandals. I was sore in weird places this morning, so I took it easy and picked a loop route that'd limit my distance.

The run went better than I'd hoped. The sore calves and irritated big toe of this morning didn't bother me. It felt light and easy a few times, which was nice, and it never felt bad. My HR hit my target in the first mile after the warm-up but edged up a little in Miles 3 and 4. Not horribly, but enough to remind me to be cautious.

Walked first and last 5 minutes. Average HR for entire run: 130
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Post  Mark B Fri Jan 31, 2014 4:09 pm

Hill Run: 4.28 miles

Weather: Overcast, breezy, cool. 43 degrees. Gear: Altras, shorts, T, jacket. Fuel: Yogurt/cereal breakfast. GU brew during.

My body didn't want to do the usual flattish to low-rollers today, and I didn't want to obsess over splits, so it was a pretty easy decision to make that right turn at the half-mile mark and head for the hills. There's something about downshifting into granny gear that's deeply satisfying. That, and waking up those hill-climbing muscles. It felt good.

I used to avoid hill running to preserve my low HR purity. But I have discovered that it's actually easier to keep the HR in the target range as I roll up and down the hills than trying to hold a steady state on the flats. Go figure.

It's also nice to sail down the hills, finding the balance between speed (I hit a 7:35 pace at one point) and effort level.

Bet you can figure out where that was.... Smile

What Comes Next  - Page 11 Screen26

I turned around at two miles, because I don't want to overdo it in my first real week of my training. I'm just happy to be able to get out there again. I'll stretch out the distance as my body gets back into the swing of things.

Walked first and last 5 minutes. Average HR for entire run: 130

--

Oh, and another thing for you nature lovers out there. I was getting ready for my run this morning when I looked out the back window and saw this:

What Comes Next  - Page 11 Hawk10

I think it was a Cooper's Hawk. Luckily I had a camera on the counter with a zoom lens and could get a photo before it flew away. Very pretty.
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Post  Nick Morris Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:28 pm

Wow...That photo is awesome!!!
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Post  Nick Morris Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:28 pm

Mark B wrote:
ounce wrote:EVVVVVVVERYONE is used to Mark by now.

By the way,          I thought you        were supposed     to run        conversationally     ,     and not in      choppy        verbal phrases        ?

Picked up on that, did you? I noticed it myself. Even though my heart rate was relatively low, running in those sandals had me going huff-puff-huff-puff the whole time. It was really weird!

I'm guessing it was because I was running much more on my forefoot than usual, and changing my mechanics to accommodate it. It got a little easier after a while, but never as easy as going barefoot.

HAHAHAHAHA
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Post  Mark B Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:25 pm

Nick Morris wrote:
Mark B wrote:
ounce wrote:EVVVVVVVERYONE is used to Mark by now.

By the way,          I thought you        were supposed     to run        conversationally     ,     and not in      choppy        verbal phrases        ?

Picked up on that, did you? I noticed it myself. Even though my heart rate was relatively low, running in those sandals had me going huff-puff-huff-puff the whole time. It was really weird!

I'm guessing it was because I was running much more on my forefoot than usual, and changing my mechanics to accommodate it. It got a little easier after a while, but never as easy as going barefoot.

HAHAHAHAHA

Oh, I amuse you?



(Yipes! This clip was not edited for television, btw...)


Last edited by Mark B on Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post  Mark B Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:27 pm

Nick Morris wrote:Wow...That photo is awesome!!!

Thanks! Not bad, considering I took it though a window. We had a heron back there once, which was cool, but I think this is cooler. No fish in the water (only a few frogs), so they don't stick around.
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Post  Lobo Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:00 pm

Mark -- after watching the test run I'm going to say something I never thought I would. Go back to barefoot.

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Post  Schuey Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:13 pm

You always have great pictures to post Mr. Paperman!!! I love love love the Hawk!!!
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Post  Mark B Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:17 pm

Schuey wrote:You always have great pictures to post Mr. Paperman!!! I love love love the Hawk!!!

Thanks, Schuey! I'm just glad I looked out the back window when I did, and had a camera within arm's reach. Very Happy
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Post  Mark B Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:19 pm

Lobo wrote:Mark -- after watching the test run I'm going to say something I never thought I would.  Go back to barefoot.

Dave Wolfe

Gasp!

And I think you're right. Thanks, Dave.
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Post  ounce Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:08 pm

The bird looks stuffed.   Wink
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Post  Mark B Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:24 pm

ounce wrote:The bird looks stuffed.   Wink

Shh! Don't point out the price tag. I forgot to cut it off! Wink

Actually, it was very still. Until I got a little closer to get a better angle, and then it flew to the fence, then away.
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Post  Mark B Sun Feb 02, 2014 2:12 pm

Low HR Run: 6.63 miles

Weather: Chilly, foggy. 32 degrees. Gear: Altras, tights, T, pullover, jacket, hat, gloves (off and on). Fuel: Grape Nuts and coffee before. Nothing during.

A run on the Salmon Creek Greenway Trail this morning, rounding my weekly miles at about 30 for the first time since the Mount Hood 50 as I begin preparations for adventures to come. The conditions weren't great. It was freezing and foggy. We didn't have any ice problems from freezing fog, but the extra moisture in the air made the cold pretty penetrating -- especially when a light breeze picked up.

We were targeting 6 to 8 miles and turned around shortly after 3 miles in after my buddy's knee started giving him trouble. We ended up having to walk a few times when he felt like his leg was about to give out on him. He really needs to get that looked at, if only to get the right exercises to rebalance his musculature.

If all goes well, my plan is to aim for 12 miles tomorrow.

Walked first and last 5 minutes (or so). Average HR for entire run: 131
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Post  Mark B Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:34 pm

Long Run: 12.26 miles

Weather: Snow, sleet, rain, wind, sun. 35 degrees. Gear: Altras, tights,  T, pullover, jacket, hat, gloves. Fuel: Yogurt and cereal for breakfast. GU Brew (electrolytes only) on run, though I took a GU at about 9.66 miles to head off an imminent bonk.

A challenging run this morning. Not only am I ramping up the miles, and doing my first back-to-back, but I picked a chily morning with all sorts of interesting weather. I got snow, ice pellets, sleet and a good amount of rain, and wind. Oh yes, some wind, too. If I hadn't geared up properly, I'd have been pretty miserable. As it stood, it wasn't too bad, though it created an opportunity for body graffiti.

What Comes Next  - Page 11 15572510

I did start to warm up when the sun actually came out later, though. Quite the range of conditions. Sheesh! It's supposed to get back down into the teens later this week, so that'll be interesting.

I tried something a little different this morning, not making my usual pit stop at the start of the trail and pressing on as far as possible. It caused my speed to fall off pretty significantly, but I'm hopeful there will be a physiological benefit even in that. It was, if nothing else, good practice at continuing to chug along as my legs complained. I held off fueling until I absolutely had to.

It'll be nice when this distance is the warm-up. Smile

Walked first and last 5 minutes. Average HR for entire run: 137
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Post  ounce Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:57 pm

Mark B wrote:Long Run: 12.26 miles

Weather: Snow, sleet, rain, wind, sun. 35 degrees. Gear: Altras, tights,  T, pullover, jacket, hat, gloves. Fuel: Yogurt and cereal for breakfast. GU Brew (electrolytes only) on run, though I took a GU at about 9.66 miles to head off an imminent bonk.

A challenging run this morning. Not only am I ramping up the miles, and doing my first back-to-back, but I picked a chily morning with all sorts of interesting weather. I got snow, ice pellets, sleet and a good amount of rain, and wind. Oh yes, some wind, too. If I hadn't geared up properly, I'd have been pretty miserable. As it stood, it wasn't too bad, though it created an opportunity for body graffiti.

What Comes Next  - Page 11 15572510

I did start to warm up when the sun actually came out later, though. Quite the range of conditions. Sheesh! It's supposed to get back down into the teens later this week, so that'll be interesting.

I tried something a little different this morning, not making my usual pit stop at the start of the trail and pressing on as far as possible. It caused my speed to fall off pretty significantly, but I'm hopeful there will be a physiological benefit even in that. It was, if nothing else, good practice at continuing to chug along as my legs complained. I held off fueling until I absolutely had to.

It'll be nice when this distance is the warm-up. Smile

Walked first and last 5 minutes. Average HR for entire run: 137

You forgot "nor gloom of night."

So, a pitstop is an actual refueling stop and not a pee break?  I can't imagine your legs hurting because you didn't pee.  If it's an eating break, you legs and your body will adapt.  Your legs are probably saying "bastardbastardbastardbastard".
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Post  Mark B Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:09 pm

ounce wrote:
Mark B wrote:Long Run: 12.26 miles

Weather: Snow, sleet, rain, wind, sun. 35 degrees. Gear: Altras, tights,  T, pullover, jacket, hat, gloves. Fuel: Yogurt and cereal for breakfast. GU Brew (electrolytes only) on run, though I took a GU at about 9.66 miles to head off an imminent bonk.

A challenging run this morning. Not only am I ramping up the miles, and doing my first back-to-back, but I picked a chily morning with all sorts of interesting weather. I got snow, ice pellets, sleet and a good amount of rain, and wind. Oh yes, some wind, too. If I hadn't geared up properly, I'd have been pretty miserable. As it stood, it wasn't too bad, though it created an opportunity for body graffiti.

What Comes Next  - Page 11 15572510

I did start to warm up when the sun actually came out later, though. Quite the range of conditions. Sheesh! It's supposed to get back down into the teens later this week, so that'll be interesting.

I tried something a little different this morning, not making my usual pit stop at the start of the trail and pressing on as far as possible. It caused my speed to fall off pretty significantly, but I'm hopeful there will be a physiological benefit even in that. It was, if nothing else, good practice at continuing to chug along as my legs complained. I held off fueling until I absolutely had to.

It'll be nice when this distance is the warm-up. Smile

Walked first and last 5 minutes. Average HR for entire run: 137

You forgot "nor gloom of night."

So, a pitstop is an actual refueling stop and not a pee break?  I can't imagine your legs hurting because you didn't pee.  If it's an eating break, you legs and your body will adapt.  Your legs are probably saying "bastardbastardbastardbastard".

Pit stop = Pee stop. But I didn't need to (unusual for me), so I kept on running. My legs were going "but... but... but..." -- but they survived.

My legs are kinda sore. Felt like a longer run than 12. But I have made a pretty abrupt transition back into training, so it doesn't come as a surprise.
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Post  ounce Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:45 pm

I was hoping 'pit stop' wasn't just used in Texas.

For me, when I started doing leg lifts consistently in the summer (flat on the back, lift leg or legs up to 90 degree, then down, rinse, repeat), I didn't have to have a pit stop as often.  I could go 8 or 9 miles, instead of less than 3.

The mysteries of the body.
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