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35, 5, and 2

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35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:14 pm

So, I’ve been trying to figure out how to keep a diary on progressing to my goals for the ’12-’13 marathon season. Training Peaks isn’t all that friendly to what I want to put down and I didn’t just want to put it in Word.

I decided to take up space on this server and chronicle my happenings here because I will just have to scroll up to review, rather than trying to remember a date on another website for what I did on a particular run. I don’t believe it to be all that reader-worthy, but I’ll let the reader grade its worthiness for a return visit. I’m a private person, so this will be strictly running and/or conditioning related. I will say that I have a quirky sense of humor as evidenced by the website www.despair.com.

Jumping right in, my objectives for the season (which runs from now until March of 2013) is to lose 35 pounds by June to get me to 165, run 5 marathons from October to March as part of the Texas Marathon Challenge, and to the 2013 Houston faster than I did 2012. One of these days, I might explain what the ‘2’ stands for, but for now, I’m not.

I have no marathons planned until October and I might have just one 5K to race at the end of March. The marathons I have scoped out for possible registration are: West Texas Crossroads Marathon in Odessa, Texas on October 6, Fort Worth Marathon, November 11, Bryan-College Station Marathon on December 9, Houston Marathon on January 13 and the final one might be the USA Fit Marathon in Sugar Land around January 31 or so.

Now until June is prime weight losing season for me, even though I'll start my marathon training in late April for Odessa. I'll be doing CrossFit, running, and losing weight. Last year, I lost 30 pounds and I expect to lose another 35.

Let's see what happens.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Mark B on Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:04 pm

An Ounce blog! Too cool.

Good luck on your journey. I look forward to following your efforts this year, but mostly I'm dying (DYING, I say!) to find out what the "2" means. Very Happy
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Dave-O on Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:46 pm

Hmm, I think I have a good guess at what the "2" means, but I'll keep it to myself. I'll let you cross 35 and 5 off the list first.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Michele "1L" Keane on Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:34 pm

Yeah, a Doug blog. I'm certain the next time I see you, I won't be able to find you - keep up the great weight loss work, and I know that I have to join you in one of those TX marathons to get that state out of the way. Odessa; however, although a scenic place with lots of out of work oil derricks (well at least in the late 1990s when I last went there), probably is not on the list Wink
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:49 pm

I thank y'all for stopping by, as the door has opened and the sign is on the shingle.

Mark, I'm sorry I'm going to have to keep you in suspense, but I just need to do it. Dave, that would be pretty bizarre if you really believe you know what it is. Time will tell.

Ah, Michele, more derricks are working but the area is dotted with wind machines all over the area. I chose Odessa because it works in the schedule. I imagine the temperatures will be similar to Chicago in early October. There were less than 100 finishers, last year, so running the tangents should be easy. Because you like hills, I'd recommend either Dallas White Rock in December, Austin in February or Cowtown in late February in Fort Worth.

Thanks again, y'all. Let's record some data.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:25 pm

Just to catch up on the running, I'm listing date, distance, pace and HR avg. All of these runs were done under the premise of running at 140 avg, which is 70% of HR max, to see what pace that equates to being. Sometimes I hit it and sometimes I don't.


  • Jan 23 4 miles, 11:21, 149 bpm
  • Jan 25 5.28 miles, 14:13, 130 bpm dead legs
  • Jan 27 5.76 miles, 11:22, 145 bpm
  • Jan 31 8.07 miles, 12:14, 142 bpm
  • Feb 3 8.09 miles, 12:11, 142 bpm
  • Feb 7, 8.03 miles, 11:54, 143 bpm
  • Feb 8, 4.01 miles, 13:04, 133 bpm
  • Feb 13, 8.08 miles, 12:25, 141 bpm

Temperatures were usually seasonal in the 40's to 50's. It would seem a 71% HR gets me a 12:10 pace. I like that because my pace at Houston was 13:09 at 75%. So, I'll be working on getting my HR down and stay at the same pace.

Today's run was 4 miles with the objective of seeing how far I could go at a pace of 10:xx. My son gave me the idea.


  1. 10:20 pace & 144 bpm. And that was as far as I could go at that pace.
  2. 11:38 pace and 137 bpm
  3. 11:34 pace and 143 bpm
  4. 11:19 pace and 148 bpm

An hour later, I was at my CrossFit box doing


  • 3 to 6 Rope Climbs
  • 3x 100 m sled dragging 115 pounds. Treated this like hill training and ran as much as I could
  • Lateral Sits accumulate 2:00 total time
  • 300 m Farmers Carry carrying a 26 lb kettle bell in each hand.
  • Reverse Wall Shots 30 to 50

Did a pretty thorough warm-up, including a 300 meter run. It really does help me out on the conditioning. I enjoy doing CrossFit.

I'm doing the Paleo diet, being 90% faithful to the concept. I need a 1/2 cup of cooked rice a week to keep me from getting lack of complex carbs side effects. Doing CrossFit and Paleo compliment each other.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:05 am

Ran 8 miles, this morning. 57 degrees. The effort did not match the heart rate because my quads were still tired from Wednesday's 115 lb 3x100m sled dragging. My legs felt like they were doing faster than 12's, but my heart rate was pumping like it was almost a 13.

But I was glad to stress the quads for the mitochondria that will be produced. Here are the splits.


  1. 12:17, 129 bpm
  2. 12:02, 136 bpm
  3. 12:31, 134 bpm
  4. 12:22, 135 bpm
  5. 12:30, 135 bpm
  6. 12:31, 135 bpm
  7. 12:45, 134 bpm
  8. 12:36, 137 bpm

8.09 miles, 1:40:48, 12:27 average and 135 bpm avg, with a max of 153 during mile 6. No aches, other than the quads.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Kenny B. on Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:32 pm

Glad to see a new blog. I hope to follow along your journey!
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:05 pm

@Kenny B. wrote:Glad to see a new blog. I hope to follow along your journey!

Thanks, K. Plenty of room in the back of the truck.

Today, I was either going to run 9 miles and not do CrossFit or run 5 miles, then do CrossFit. I chose the 5 miles because I need more cross training than I need miles. Further, I'm not running or anything this weekend, so I can push the envelope a bit by doing a double now and nothing until Monday.

56 degrees with no rain, as the forecast for rain in the morning slid to the afternoon. I felt a bit better in my legs, when compared to yesterday, but not completely fixed since Wednesday's sled dragging. Here are the splits.


  1. 12:10, 128 bpm
  2. 12:01, 135 bpm
  3. 12:20, 132 bpm
  4. 12:20, 140 bpm
  5. 12:29, 139 bpm

A total of 1:01.49 for 5.04 miles at an average of 135 bpm, with a 155 max bpm.

Today's CrossFit WOD (workout of the day)

Strength

In 18 minutes do:


  1. Bent Over Rows sets of 5 work up to 75% of max. Started at 50 lbs and got to 90.
  2. Kettlebell Floor Press sets of 5 with 20 lb KB in each hand. Might could've done 26#
  3. Wall Shoulder Slides x10. This was CAKE, but some with tight shoulders, it was stressful.

Conditioining

3 Rounds as fast as possible doing:


  • 21 Push Ups. I do knee push ups due to upper body weakness
  • 12 Pull Ups by using rings for same reason as push ups
  • 400m. Ah, something I can do well! Got heart rate up to 176 or 88%. The last 400m I did at an 8:17 pace. (There was a guy behind me and I was sprinting the last 100m)

So that was 5 miles at 68% and 1,200m at 80%+, before 6 a.m. Nice. I am pleased to see my heart rate declining, the more I'm in the 12 minute range. It tells me the heart has already made its adjustments and improvements to efficiencies to the extent that my lungs and legs need to catch up. I wish the lungs and legs could adapt so quickly. Durn mitochondria.

In a week or 2, I think I'll do a 12 mile run to see if I can maintain a low 12 average & splits at 65%. If I can, I believe that'll be my body's signal that I can go faster. Keep in mind that I was doing 13 minute miles at 65% on long runs back in Q4.

Weight this morning is 194, down 6 and 29 to go.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:46 pm

I signed up for a Houston running clinic called Power In Motion (www.powerinmotion.org) that really does a good job of the Couch to 5K method. And it also has people that can run a few miles or more than 10 miles a week for which their goal is to run a faster 5K.

I did it last Fall as my speed work. I really credit Power In Motion with bringing out my harder core competitive streak. I ended up running a PR in Dallas by about 90 seconds.

It starts the 29th for 12 weeks.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Mon Feb 20, 2012 10:02 am

I believe the heart rate strap was not making good enough contact early on, just based on the HR for miles 1 and 2.

Overall, I believe my heart has adapted to the mid-12's because the heart rate is in the 65-67% range, when just 1 week ago (Feb 13) a 12:25 average was at 71%. My lungs haven't and my legs haven't, but that blasted heart has.

I was leaving a bit later than normal to run the 8 miles and one of the regular 4 a.m. guys at Memorial Park that runs faster than I was going to be coming up from behind me, today, as we usually pass by each other. So he passes me and I shadow him to see what his pace is. It ends up being around 10:30 and I file that away. That's why the mile 4 time is quicker.

I want to see how long it takes my lungs to get comfortable running the faster pace. Here are the figures.

50 degrees with a slight east wind.


  1. 12:42, 132 bpm
  2. 12:06, 128 bpm
  3. 12:09, 131 bpm
  4. 11:54, 139 bpm (shadowing 10:30 guy)
  5. 12:25, 130 bpm
  6. 12:28, 132 bpm
  7. 12:32, 133 bpm
  8. 12:28, 133 bpm

8.1 miles, 1:39:59, 12:20 average. No negative split on that run. First half 12:12, second half 12:28.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:24 am

Four mile run and CrossFit, this morning. My circulatory system amazes me. My heart rate has dropped like a rock over the past couple of weeks. My lungs and legs haven't caught up with the blood. I'm disappointed seeing mile 4 over a minute slower than mile 1. The lungs were starting to get in an easier rhythm during mile 3. It might could be the 12:15/mile range is appropriate pace for the moment.

The run 54 degrees


  1. 11.28, 128 bpm
  2. 11.36, 131 bpm
  3. 12.19, 131 bpm
  4. 12:43, 129 bpm

Total 4.01 miles, 48:16, 12:01 pace, 130 avg HR, max 137

CrossFit

Strength


  1. Hang Squat Snatch sets of 2 - 57 pounds, felt wobbly
  2. Push Press sets of 5 - 45 lb
  3. Lacrosse Ball Pecs and Rear Shoulder-felt really good

Conditioning


  1. 750 m Row - what a booger
  2. 50 Push Ups - what a bitch
  3. 30 Goblet Lunge Steps -20 lb kettlebell, better than I thought I'd do.
  4. 400 m Run - max HR of 172 (86%) Hard not trying to catch people.

At work, I run a 12 week weight loss team competition. It starts today and usually has about 45 people, out of about 650 at our location. So, I ate up over the weekend to inflate the weight and had pho ga, yesterday, to assist in retaining water for the initial weigh in today.

Y'all have a good day.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Mark B on Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:04 am

Don't worry about the pace fall-off at that heart rate, Ounce. Those trailing miles will get faster as those little mitochondrial energy factories get built. It takes a while (six weeks, to be exact) for them to come on line, but when they do? You'll like it.

Actually, looking back on your splits, you're already showing some nice improvements. 'Grats! Approval
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:05 am

Thanks, Mark. I have to remember that, as I post the following less than encouraging 12 mile run and related comments.

I had mentioned in a prior post about running a 10-12 mile distance to evaluate progress over a longer than 8 mile distance. Alas, it did not show progress. I was going to run it today, but circumstances changed and had to run it on Thursday. Factors include a 70 degree morning, 15-20 degrees warmer than normal and not carbed enough to give my muscles a chance to succeed. Reina told me once that she doesn't carbo load for a race. I have to ask her about that, because I couldn't do that. I would cramp something fierce.

My legs didn't feel dead, just underpowered. In the past, I could quantify 30 seconds a mile difference for every 5 degrees above 60 degrees. Now that I'm lighter, it could be about 15 seconds. So, it could be I'm on track for speeding up. Yet another hypothesis to test at a later date.

This was a 12 mile run (actually 11.84) on a road I have run frequently over the years. The objective was to run it at 65% (130 bpm) and see what time that produced. Here are the splits. 70 degrees, 2:35:47, 13:09 pace, average HR 133, max HR 151 in mile 1. First half 13:04, last half 13:14.


  1. 12:57, 123 bpm (strap seemed not to be wet enough)
  2. 12:42, 131 bpm
  3. 13:11, 133 bpm
  4. 13:21, 132 bpm
  5. 13:06, 131 bpm
  6. 13:10, 131 bpm
  7. 13:13, 132 bpm
  8. 13:00, 134 bpm (wanted to get the overall pace time down)
  9. 12:57, 137 bpm
  10. 13:06, 137 bpm
  11. 13:29, 139 bpm
  12. 13:42, 138 bpm (sad, sad, sad)
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Mark B on Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:11 pm

@ounce wrote:... less than encouraging 12 mile run

  1. 12:57, 123 bpm (strap seemed not to be wet enough)
  2. 12:42, 131 bpm
  3. 13:11, 133 bpm
  4. 13:21, 132 bpm
  5. 13:06, 131 bpm
  6. 13:10, 131 bpm
  7. 13:13, 132 bpm
  8. 13:00, 134 bpm (wanted to get the overall pace time down)
  9. 12:57, 137 bpm
  10. 13:06, 137 bpm
  11. 13:29, 139 bpm
  12. 13:42, 138 bpm (sad, sad, sad)

Whoa, there, cowboy. I don't know what dictionary you're looking at to find the definition of "less than encouraging," but you might want to find a new one. Because as I look at this, I don't see a disappointing run. I see a solid effort with a very predictable fade as time went on. You were nearly two and a half hours into your run when things got harder. At this stage of the game, that's to be expected.

If your legs felt underpowered, it's probably a sign that you needed a little more rest going into this run. This cross-fit work you are doing is pretty intense (fast 400m, anyone?), and you're bound to feel it when you're working on the aerobic endurance side of the equation.

Don't be so hard on yourself. You're making progress. Just keep at it, and remember to let it come to you. If you force it, it'll blow up in your face.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:29 pm

Thanks, Mark. I had taken the prior day off from running and crossfit, but I believe it was a combination of the 70 degree weather and being under carbed for the run.

Being on Paleo form of eating does not allow for extra carbs lying around, so I have to eat a proper amount of rice or pasta to counter this. Just have to find that figure and consume it early enough for the benefit of the run.

Haven't run all weekend, according to plan. Weight, 192, -8 total.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Mark B on Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:02 am

@ounce wrote:Thanks, Mark. I had taken the prior day off from running and crossfit, but I believe it was a combination of the 70 degree weather and being under carbed for the run.

Being on Paleo form of eating does not allow for extra carbs lying around, so I have to eat a proper amount of rice or pasta to counter this. Just have to find that figure and consume it early enough for the benefit of the run.

Haven't run all weekend, according to plan. Weight, 192, -8 total.

Paleo diet? What's that: You only eat what you can club or pull up?
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Michele "1L" Keane on Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:31 pm

I like Mark's description of the Paleo diet. Doug - your splits on that run look good so stop beating yourself up. I also think the Paleo diet can effect you in the beginning as you are now getting your carbs from more natural sources. I don't truly follow the Paleo diet as I allow myself oatmeal most mornings and a post-run bagel on Sunday morning, but for the most part I'm pretty good. Of course, not when I'm in Houston and get to eat good Mexican (next time!).
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:58 pm

@Mark B wrote:
@ounce wrote:Thanks, Mark. I had taken the prior day off from running and crossfit, but I believe it was a combination of the 70 degree weather and being under carbed for the run.

Being on Paleo form of eating does not allow for extra carbs lying around, so I have to eat a proper amount of rice or pasta to counter this. Just have to find that figure and consume it early enough for the benefit of the run.

Haven't run all weekend, according to plan. Weight, 192, -8 total.

Paleo diet? What's that: You only eat what you can club or pull up?

@Michele "1L" Keane wrote:I like Mark's description of the Paleo diet. Doug - your splits on that run look good so stop beating yourself up. I also think the Paleo diet can effect you in the beginning as you are now getting your carbs from more natural sources. I don't truly follow the Paleo diet as I allow myself oatmeal most mornings and a post-run bagel on Sunday morning, but for the most part I'm pretty good. Of course, not when I'm in Houston and get to eat good Mexican (next time!).

We don't have any clubs in Texas. It's a gun. But, the Paleo diet excludes sugar added to stuff (as opposed to fruit which has sugar in it naturally), grains and dairy. I lost about 12 pounds being on it, last May-July. I stayed faithful about 85% of the time since then. Now, I'm about 98% faithful to it. Rice and popcorn are the 2%.

Loren Cordain came up with the diet and I'm fine with it. To me, his diet gained legitimacy when he wrote the book "Paleo Diet for Athletes" and said early on in the book (page 16 or so) that endurance athletes can eat white rice and pasta during training because you couldn't eat enough vegetables to get the carbs that rice and pasta provide.

Michele eats some oatmeal and a bagel. During training, I was rice or pasta. Since I'm not training for some race, I have to find the balance of how much rice is enough for the miles I run. Last year, I was running 10-12 miles a week & doing CrossFit and the Paleo diet for non-athletes was fine. Now, I'm about 20 miles a week & doing CrossFit and my body revolts if I haven't had enough rice at the right time.

Thank you, Michele, for stopping by and giving me your thoughts. I'll work on being easier on myself.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:53 pm

I was able to run on a Monday afternoon for the first time since I can't remember when. So, I decided to drive up to Memorial Park and run the 3 mile loop a couple of times to see how my body is feeling. I was thinking of going at 70% and see what happens.

My heart rate strap was going bonkers as I was being told I was at 77%, when the effort wasn't. Seemed like the strap dried out before I started running. I re-wet the strap and it seemed to settle down somewhat, but maybe I was at that effort. At 3 miles, I was getting tired and thought to stop, but I wanted to do another loop.

The skies were overcast and 70 degrees. 6.02 miles, 1:13:53, avg HR 141, max 164.


  1. 12:27, 142 bpm
  2. 12:02, 139 bpm
  3. 12:18, 134 bpm
  4. 12:27, 141 bpm
  5. 12:13, 144 bpm
  6. 12:19, 143 bpm
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Mark B on Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:01 am

The Paleo diet sounds interesting. I did South Beach once with great success, but I was never able to figure out how to make it work while running.

Bonkers HR straps are normal for me in the first mile, especially when it's cold and/or dry. I goop mine up with some Aloe Vera gel, and that usually works - unless I wait too long and it soaks in.

Solid run!
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Reina on Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:08 am

Hey ... glad I found this! :-) I think you are making good progress ... and I'm happy to chat more about what type of carb loading I do or don't do ... but I eat a lot more carbs overall on a regular basis than I think you do.

And I have a good guess at the "2" myself!

:-)

Happy running/crossfit Doug!

--Reina
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  KathyK on Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:12 am

I wonder if the folks who are thinking they know about the '2' have guessed the same thing.
I have no earthly idea what it stands for...but I hope you accomplish that goal no matter what it is!
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  Michele "1L" Keane on Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:37 pm

Never even thought about the "2". Just keep those carbs in check, Doug, as I am sure you will since you've been successful with this plan before. I often run low on carbs and can tell.
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Re: 35, 5, and 2

Post  ounce on Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:18 pm

@Mark B wrote:The Paleo diet sounds interesting. I did South Beach once with great success, but I was never able to figure out how to make it work while running.

Bonkers HR straps are normal for me in the first mile, especially when it's cold and/or dry. I goop mine up with some Aloe Vera gel, and that usually works - unless I wait too long and it soaks in.

Solid run!

You could check out "The Paleo Solution" by Robb Wolf or "The Paleo Diet for Athletes" by Loren Cordain. Wolf's book is supposed to have some humor in it, whereas Cordain's book is more chemistry driven. I've read both.

Guess I need to purchase some gel. Thanks, Mark.

@Reina wrote:Hey ... glad I found this! :-) I think you are making good progress ... and I'm happy to chat more about what type of carb loading I do or don't do ... but I eat a lot more carbs overall on a regular basis than I think you do.

And I have a good guess at the "2" myself!

:-)

Happy running/crossfit Doug!

--Reina

So glad you got lost in my blog. I will quiz you on it, later. As for you, it appears your niggles are not holding you back any on your running. Don't be a stranger!

@KathyK wrote:I wonder if the folks who are thinking they know about the '2' have guessed the same thing.
I have no earthly idea what it stands for...but I hope you accomplish that goal no matter what it is!

Thanks, Kathy, for stopping by. One will never know for sure, until I tell them about the 2.

@Michele "1L" Keane wrote:Never even thought about the "2". Just keep those carbs in check, Doug, as I am sure you will since you've been successful with this plan before. I often run low on carbs and can tell.

Hey, Michele. I have likened dead legs as the idiot light on the dashboard that means "Low Fuel" and the cramps I get that tells me, "You're OUT of gas".

My thanks to all of y'all for taking the time to type something.
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Explaining To Spouse
Explaining To Spouse

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